Please, Stop vilifying targeting.

[LongTimeSooner]

Please do not call those called for targeting/ not called for targeting 'thugs' or make them out to be malicious players.

Until 2013, these hits were just football. All of you, like me, used to admire these loud hits as just being physical. Only after the rule (which is a good rule) did helmet to helmet/leading with the helmet on a helmet hit become bad.

Calling a defender a thug because he is caught in a play moving faster than most of us will ever move outside a vehicle is just dumb, and it could easily happen to our altar boys on any given play.

The rule change has netted an overall technique change in football defenses that is good. But calling a defender evil because he puts his hat on another dude in a reactionary response is a little too strong.

 

[Plainosooner]

Please don't minimize what should have been outlawed years ago, but finally is. Hitting a guy in the helmet when he is in somebody else's tackle and going down is classless. There is a difference between that, and being the first there. Sometimes heads collide quickly. But that's not the case with what Oakman did to Knight last season, or what the tackler did to Mayfield last night. Or the hit on Mixon last night.

There is no game worth watching where the players intentionally play to injure other players. There is a difference between hard nosed football and cheap shot play. Baylor is way over in number two.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

Please don't minimize what should have been outlawed years ago, but finally is. Hitting a guy in the helmet when he is in somebody else's tackle and going down is classless. There is a difference between that, and being the first there. Sometimes heads collide quickly. But that's not the case with what Oakman did to Knight last season, or what the tackler did to Mayfield last night. Or the hit on Mixon last night.

There is no game worth watching where the players intentionally play to injure other players. There is a difference between hard nosed football and cheap shot play. Baylor is way over in number two.

Well said, it is a thug move now. Baylor intentionally tried to hurt Mayfield.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

This board should be open to posters comments, you are not the poster police, who made Long time Sooner, tell us what to say or not say. Sorry but that pisses me off.

 

[LongTimeSooner]

I watched both hits from last night's game just now, and I just don't see them being classless. How about talking trash on Orlando Brown when he fired out on Oakman's head on the ground in the 1st qtr? Does that make him a thug?

I agree that thuggery is bad. I am saying that 'targeting' does not automatically qualify for the label, nor was there anything about Baylor's game that there wasn't plenty of on the other side of the ball.

PS I like 'plenty of mustard' on defense. Doesn't mean I like thuggery.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

I guess you need to change your colors to green, it's about time our players show some guts, yes we were guilty of some. I will never called my Sooners a thug.

 

[LongTimeSooner]

Well said, it is a thug move now. Baylor intentionally tried to hurt Mayfield.

Did you applaud the flag when Mayfield got horsecollared and hurt last night?

I did! And guess what, we can thank Roy Williams, one of our best defenders ever who made a living off that form, for the flag. Does anyone ever call Roy dirty or a thug?

 

[soonerfastnloud]

Those players tried everything from faking injury to illegal hits. I despise those players.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

Did you applaud the flag when Mayfield got horsecollared and hurt last night?

I did! And guess what, we can thank Roy Williams, one of our best defenders ever who made a living off that form, for the flag. Does anyone ever call Roy dirty or a thug?

Man what are you mad about, I will stick up for my Sooners at all cost. Are you sure you are a SOONER

 

[LongTimeSooner]

Those players tried everything from faking injury to illegal hits. I despise those players.

You're letting emotion feed your fire. It's fine to hate Baylor and the fact they resort to cheap crap. I agree that faking injury should be a flag and maybe get a guy tossed!

Just don't let the magic appearance of helmet to helmet hits be excuse to call them dirty alone.

 

[LongTimeSooner]

Is Matt Dimon a thug for dropping a cleat in a deep snapper on his back's face last night? I guarantee you hyper-emotional Baylor fans do.

I don't think so. Even after he got tossed and even jawed some cuss words at the crowd on his way out. He's just a football player who wants to win.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

coming from a so-called religious school, they sure didn't show it last night. Since you brought up Roy Williams don't forget about Baylor's murder cover up.

 

[LongTimeSooner]

coming from a so-called religious school, they sure didn't show it last night. Since you brought up Roy Williams don't forget about Baylor's murder cover up.

You need to start a new thread called "Reasons I hate Baylor" because you're just arguing strawmen in this one.

 

[Plainosooner]

LT, I will agree with you that not every target penalty is evidence of thuggery. But Baylor didn't just do it to OU. Their head hunting against TCU a couple of years ago made Patterson so mad that I thought he was going to have a stroke. And he was right to be furious. Then the guy kicked out of the game after a classless hit, didn't leave the game immediately as required and made a scene on the sidelines.

I think if you'll look closely at the Dimon call, it was not close to intentional. He barely hit the guy and his leg was tied up in the scrum. The referee saw the play and tried to talk the guy who threw the flag out of ejecting Dimon but the other official was adamant. Compared to what Oakman did to Knight a year ago, it is absurd that Dimon was ejected but Oakman wasn't. Then when Shawn started messing with Knight after a throw, Brown decided to send Shawn a message. Those of us who see Baylor for whatever reason, get away with excessive cheap shots on a weekly basis, we hated what Brown did, but understand that sometimes players have to police what officials don't. It was retaliation.

And I'd suggest you go read the congratulatory thread started by a visiting West Virginia fan. He sees the same thing we are,and that you seem to disagree with. We're not alone in our view of Briles' team. I would love for an investigative guy take a look and their inner workings. I fully believer they are paying bounties for injury. The whole thing with Lebby illegally on the Tulsa bench is just further evidence of the lack of ethics in the Baylor program. And their under the table lack of ethics goes back four decades. Some of their inner workings are despicable.

From how they tried to cover up illegalities in the basketball program after the death of a player. Baylor athletics is corrupt. But stuff like that tends to see the light of day eventually.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

LT, I will agree with you that not every target penalty is evidence of thuggery. But Baylor didn't just do it to OU. Their head hunting against TCU a couple of years ago made Patterson so mad that I thought he was going to have a stroke. And he was right to be furious. Then the guy kicked out of the game after a classless hit, didn't leave the game immediately as required and made a scene on the sidelines.

I think if you'll look closely at the Dimon call, it was not close to intentional. He barely hit the guy and his leg was tied up in the scrum. The referee saw the play and tried to talk the guy who threw the flag out of ejecting Dimon but the other official was adamant. Compared to what Oakman did to Knight a year ago, it is absurd that Dimon was ejected but Oakman wasn't. Then when Shawn started messing with Knight after a throw, Brown decided to send Shawn a message. Those of us who see Baylor for whatever reason, get away with excessive cheap shots on a weekly basis, we hated what Brown did, but understand that sometimes players have to police what officials don't. It was retaliation.

And I'd suggest you go read the congratulatory thread started by a visiting West Virginia fan. He sees the same thing we are,and that you seem to disagree with. We're not alone in our view of Briles' team. I would love for an investigative guy take a look and their inner workings. I fully believer they are paying bounties for injury. The whole thing with Lebby illegally on the Tulsa bench is just further evidence of the lack of ethics in the Baylor program. And their under the table lack of ethics goes back four decades. Some of their inner workings are despicable.

From how they tried to cover up illegalities in the basketball program after the death of a player. Baylor athletics is corrupt. But stuff like that tends to see the light of day eventually.

well said, I really never noticed they were that bad until last year. You never see him get mad or discipline his players for personal fouls. You certainly saw Bob get mad.

 

[soonerfastnloud]

Just some comments from Patterson regarding Baylor

Patterson was discussing a play in which safety Ahmad Dixon was ejected for targeting TCU wide receiver Trevone Boykin. As Dixon was ejected, he walked off the sideline gesturing to the TCU crowd. Meanwhile, TCU wide receiver Trevone Boykin was receiving attention from trainers on the sideline.

“If [Briles] has a problem with me, he can come to where I live,” Patterson continued. “I have respect for him and I have respect for his program, but I’m not going to teach my guys that and that guy has been doing that for four years. The bottom line to it is, it wasn’t funny.

 

[Yankees03]

Longtime you must realize only a small fraction of fans here whine and cry about every call, not most. You also must realize some of the comments are justified. If a player intentionally tries to hurt someone you can usually tell. However sometimes they throw flags when it is undeserved. The game especially in the NFL now is sissified.

 

[Yankees03]

Is mixon a thug? Tapper? Alvarez? And so on.

 

[Plainosooner]

well said, I really never noticed they were that bad until last year. You never see him get mad or discipline his players for personal fouls. You certainly saw Bob get mad.

The thing is, most of these plays, Baylor wasn't penalized. They were for the target on Shep two years ago, but the ejection was overturned. Oakman got no penalty last year. The target last night on the Mixon hit was not penalized. Only the horrible horse collar was called and he clearly intentionally threw his legs at the back of Baker's legs in an attempt to injure.

If you can find a tape of the Baylor - TCU game in FW I think it was two years ago, Baylor's play was disgraceful. And Patterson was livid. And right to be. He called Briles out after the game. and at his early week presser.

Patterson post game:
https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search...youtube&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002

This is the game video of the whole game. They cut out most of when the player left, after he didn't leave the sidelines when rule required it. The play started at about 1:37 and the guy who did it is the same guy who cheap shotted Shep a month earlier. And he did it to a lot of guys. He played to injure and laughed about it on the sidelines and while leaving the field.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search...youtube&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002

 

[soonerfastnloud]

It's just like Suh, the team as a whole is getting tagged for a thug like reputation, not just Sooner fans.

 

[CTOkie]

Please don't minimize what should have been outlawed years ago, but finally is. Hitting a guy in the helmet when he is in somebody else's tackle and going down is classless. There is a difference between that, and being the first there. Sometimes heads collide quickly. But that's not the case with what Oakman did to Knight last season, or what the tackler did to Mayfield last night. Or the hit on Mixon last night.

There is no game worth watching where the players intentionally play to injure other players. There is a difference between hard nosed football and cheap shot play. Baylor is way over in number two.

Agree with Plaino.
I have noticed in recent years a much more violent game of football in which there is, in fact, an intent to injure mentality that has come into play in recent years, which is made even worse by the increase of the players' size and speed. The crap I'm seeing now I never saw 30-50 years ago, except on rare occasions.
Many contemporary fans love cheap shots to opposing players and seem to be incapable of knowing the difference in what is good hard physical play and what is a deliberate attempt to take a player out.
My concern before the game last night was having Baylor's Shawn Oakman going after Mayfield, as he did last season with Knight. I was also annoyed by the loss of composure by OU's Orlando Brown and Matt Dimon....and I will be even more annoyed if these players aren't called on the carpet over what they did. Penalties can result from this stupidity that can lose a game.
Injuries are a byproduct of football but they should not be increased by an intent to cause injury.....the violent collisions, blowing out a knee while making a cut, and rolling over a player's leg or ankle do enough of that. Remember Broyles, Gaddis, Millard, Bradford, Whaley....players who got hurt just playing the game ?
I am satisfied enough with the team going down to Waco, playing on prime time in a steady rain, and knocking off a team that was really starting to get too big for its britches.....even with OU's 22-3 record against it.

 

[LongTimeSooner]

I am thinking that many of you watch OU totally blind to the way football is played.

First, this thread was started to appeal against looking at targeting as 'proof' of dirty play. Not that 'Baylor isn't dirty.'

Second, show me a team - any team - that some opponent doesn't call dirty and full of thugs, and I'll show you a doormat or even winless team.

OU plays defense and gets silly fouls and no calls just like any other really good defense. Dirty football? Hardly. It's a man's game.

 

[WhyNotaSooner]

First, I think the game today is cleaner than it's ever been. The collisions maybe more violent but the game it self is played with a cleaner mentality then years past. I believe that we as fans and of course to the teams/players have changed as the game it self has. Having said this... this game had some serious personal fouls. These teams do not like each other and it shows. Af ter reviewing the game again, there were a lot personal fouls called and a few that wasn't. There was two that involved helemts. Helmets do not just come off the player's heads. They are either ripped off or knocked off.
1. In the 1st Qtr, OU's Alvarez gets his helmet completely ripped off his head. No call.
2. Mixon gets hit on a head to head helmet collision that literally knocked off his helmet, another no call.

But there were PF calls all throughout the game. At half time, OU had (4) against them & BU had (2) against them. I may have missed one or two but they included these by order.
1. Jordan Evans PF, roughing the passer. OU
2. Oakman PF, hitting Mayfield out of bounds, BU
3. Kastati, gets helmet ripped off, no call
4. O-lne Chop Block, BU
5. Late hit on Mayfield, no call
6. Alexander, PF slams Stidman out of bounds, OU and while Stoops is chewing him out, it's announced that...
7. Dimon PF, kicks player
8. PF Horsecollar on Mayfield against Baylor

There was some serious hitting and emotion last night. It was a clean hit, but when Tapper slams Stidman to the ground for a sack, Stidman wasn't the same afterwards.

Baylor lost 3 or 4 players that never came back. Last night, there was some hard hitting football. I like seeing OU play w/ an edge. It's something theyed missed for awhile. But when Flowers caught that pass inside the 3 yd line and their saftety came up to hit him, Flowers just bowled right over him. It took that kid 5 mins to even get up.

Speaking of Flowers, he had two great calls go to him and he executed on both. One for a TD.

 

[Soonerborn59]

There is a huge difference between incidental Helmet to Helmet and an obvious lead of a helmet to helmet. I think the rules are good for the game but should the targeting rule should only be called when it's obvious a player leads with his helmet to inflict a possible injury to the opposing player. This should have been flagged on the Mixon and how the ref standing right there missed the obvious Helmet to helmet is beyond me. That isn't football and if one can't see that he lowered his helmet on Mixon then one has to be really blind.

I love clean football and those good old fashioned hard hits but I hate dirty players who intentionally attempt to hurt another player. There was nothing clean about that hit.